3) Your Body Belongs to the State
2024-03-26 00:37:30
<p>Imagine you were a fly on the wall at a dinner between the mafia, the CIA, and the KGB. That’s where this unprecedented story begins. A journey through the dark world of Russian intelligence where, for the first time, a professed “sex spy” tells her story. All of it. </p> <p>Host Neil Strauss (Rolling Stone, The New York Times) brings listeners into the dangerous world of sexpionage, where enemies of the State are not the only victims. So too are the spies themselves, brainwashed to believe that their bodies belong to Russia and meticulously trained to become “the perfect weapons.” Who is Aliia Roza? From the creators of the hit podcast series To Live and Die in LA, this is To Die For.</p>
Hi, it's Andrea Gunning, the host of Betrayal. I'm excited to announce that the Betrayal podcast is expanding. We are going to be releasing episodes weekly, every Thursday. Each week, you'll hear brand new stories, firsthand accounts of shocking deception, broken trust, and the trail of destruction left behind. Listen to Betrayal Weekly on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.
I'm John Walczak, host of the new podcast, Missing in Arizona.
And I'm, Robert Fisher, one of the most wanted men in the world.
We cloned his voice using AI. In 2001,, police say I killed my family and rigged my house to explode. Before escaping into the wilderness.
Police believe he is alive and hiding somewhere.
Join me. I'm going down in the cave. As I track down clues. I'm going to call the police and have you removed.
Hunting. One of the most dangerous fugitives in the world.
Robert Fisher. Do you recognize my voice?
Listen to Missing in Arizona every Wednesday on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your favorite shows.
All eight episodes of To Die For are available now to binge absolutely free. But for ad-free listening and exclusive bonuses, subscribe to Tenderfoot Plus at tenderfootplus.com or on Apple Podcasts.
Warning. The following contains graphic descriptions of violence and sexual assault that may be too intense or triggering to some listeners. Discretion is advised.
He was the son of a high-ranking Soviet army officer. And he had an outstanding career with Novosti, which was also a front for the KGB.
Ideological subversion is the slow process which we call either ideological subversion or active measures. Active measures in the language of the KGB or psychological warfare. What it basically means is to change the perception of reality. Exposure to true information does not matter anymore. A person who was demoralized is unable to assess true information.
The facts tell nothing to him.
Vladimir Putin's former chief economic advisor, who had extensive access to the Russian president over the years, goes one-on-one with our Joe Khalil.
How much of the population actually is exposed to what's really happening in Ukraine?
I would say up to 70% of the Russian population have been brainwashed. Brainwashed completely. 70%, you think it's that high?
It would be, I would say, a conservative estimate.
Zhanna Agalagova was one of the stars of Russia's Channel One. Even now, when you're watching news in Russia, it's like two different planets. In one planet, there is ruins and total disaster, death and tragedy. In another world, it's Russian militaries. that was cheered by local population with flowers.
And this is only victories. In these two worlds, don't mix up.
And it blows my mind how they do it.
How they brainwashed their population.
I'm holding my gun.
I got you, I tear you apart.
I had to kill you. Was it so much fun?
Episode 3. Chapter 6. The Selection.
There are not so many schools in Russia. It's like maybe only three. One where Putin studied in St. Petersburg. Another one in Moscow.
They would call it like former KGB school. FSB was basically like they renamed it.
But my school, my academy, would be called the Academy of Military Investigation.
How do you say that in Russian?
Oh, it's.
. Академия управления Министерства внутренних дел России.
What happens once you walk in?
When I saw that huge gray color building, looking like all the Soviet Union buildings, where you cannot say a word and you understand there is no chance you could live a free life and have a free word. I just wanted to run away. But I couldn't say no and I couldn't run away and I had to go there. And I just kept myself together and I stayed silent and just walked into that walls.
Aliyah Rosa is describing her first day of formal military training after her tragic internship. She was just 18 at the time.
When I saw this thick, gray, cold walls with portraits of that former officers or KGB agents, and I saw that cold faces of all my teachers and my classmates. there were no fun or there were no desire, or, like ambitions or dreams. There were really cold-blooded machines or like zombie people.
That first day at the Academy would change the course of Aliyah's life. But before we get to that, here's a little bit about the training of new recruits at a Russian military academy.
First of all, my whole lifestyle has been changed. I would wake up at 4 a.m. because at 6 a.m. you had to have a morning report that would give you agenda, schedule and you have to do marching. From 6 a.m.
in the morning. we would listen this big words lecture about our country, that we have to protect the country, we have to be real patriot. We fought Nazi. We are the strongest country in the world. We are the strongest nationality.
We are the purest. Nothing can be more powerful than us.
You have to do exercises, you have to do jogging, you have to do shooting. You also had to do like cleaning and cooking for hundreds of people.
Then 6 p.
m. it's again the report. time. And again you have to do marching and then sometimes homework would be so much, so it would take till like 2 a.m. or like 1 a.m.
It was really tough and it was always cold. I was so tired and exhausted because I slept only 4 hours.
Well, yes, of course. The whole system is like that, right? It's one of the important technique of manipulation where, if you want to train someone, you have to exhaust this person with the physical activities, so the brain becomes weak. And when the brain becomes weak there you can plant seeds built on patriotic, romantic feeling like together we can fight the whole world.
In case patriotism wasn't enough to inspire someone to die for their country, there were also financial incentives.
So, for example, if they would say, OK, so, there is a war in Chechnya, second campaign. So who wants to go there? Because if you go to the war, first of all, you have salary much higher than usual. You have better insurance, better benefits. If you will die, then your family will get so and so much money which was higher than usual salary.
People would risk their life because it was beneficial for their families and they would go to the war. It's still the same.
Once you're there, you cannot go back. You cannot just become civilian and say, OK, I don't want to work in military anymore. I want just to be a human resource recruiter. You cannot do that. You know that once you are there, you have to be there till the rest of your life.
In this toxic environment, Aliyah's classmates competed with each other for favor, sometimes cruelly and savagely.
I tried to make friends, but after a few months I understood that whatever I would say to my girlfriends, they would tell to our teachers. So you couldn't even tell anyone secrets or the way you think or the way you feel. I had even my male classmates. They would call me bad names. Some of them tried to put me down.
You understand that you are there by yourself. You cannot have friends. You cannot rely on anyone. You know that every single one is your enemy. We say if you live with wolves, you have to become one of wolves.
Hi, it's Andrea Gunning, host of Betrayal. I'm excited to announce that the Betrayal podcast is expanding. We are going to be releasing episodes weekly, every Thursday. Each week you'll hear brand new stories. First hand accounts of shocking deception, broken trust and the trail of destruction left behind.
Stories about regaining a sense of safety, a handle on reality after your entire world is flipped upside down. From unbelievable romantic betrayals.
The love that was so real for me was always just a game for him.
To betrayals in your own family. When I think about my dad, oh, well, he is a sociopath. Financial betrayal.
This is not even the part where he steals millions of dollars.
And life or death deceptions.
She's practicing how she's going to cry when the police calls her after they kill me.
Listen to Betrayal Weekly on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts.
I'm John Walczak, host of the new podcast, Missing in Arizona.
And I'm, Robert Fisher, one of the most wanted men in the world.
We cloned his voice using AI.
In 2001, police say I killed my family.
First mom, then the kids.
And rigged my house to explode.
In a quiet suburb.
This is the Beverly Hills of the valley. Before escaping into the wilderness.
There was sleet and hail and snow coming down.
They found my wife's SUV. Right on the reservation boundary. And my dog flew.
All I can think of is he's going to sniper me out of some tree.
But not me.
Police believe he is alive and hiding somewhere.
For two years.
They won't tell you anything.
I've traveled the nation. I'm going down in the cave. Tracking down clues.
They were thinking that I picked him up and took him somewhere.
If you keep asking me this, I'm going to call the police and have you removed.
Searching for Robert Fisher.
One of the most dangerous fugitives in the world.
Do you recognize my voice? Join.
An exploding house.
The hunt.
Family annihilation.
Today.
And a disappearing act.
Listen to Missing in Arizona every Wednesday on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your favorite shows.
So, with this context, we now return to Aliyah's first day at the academy. She was lined up for inspection with the rest of the new students. And that's when it all began.
All of us, we had to be outside. And I remember there was one of the most powerful teacher at that time, with the highest rank. And he particularly looked at every single girl there. And I was the only one who was 18 years old. Other girls, they were like starting from 22,, 23,, 25, 30 even.
This high-ranking commander, a Russian colonel, began whispering to a female officer and motioning to Aliyah.
But I understood the talk about me because they looked at me and they discussed something. I didn't know. is it like bad or good. I didn't know anything. And then they also looked at some other girls.
Soon after, Aliyah was pulled aside and told that she'd been selected to participate in a special program. This, of course, was not an optional program.
This additional coursework, as I'm sure you figured out, would train Aliyah in the art of seduction. The exchange of sexuality for secrets or lives. But what does it take for a woman raised conservatively, with no dating experience, to be willing to let the state use her body like this? It would take a lot more fear and a lot more brainwashing.
There are lots of things that are involved in persuasion every day. But when things become very stressful and when the stimuli are controlled, and there are very few other stimuli other than what the perpetrator is trying to impose on you, and when you are sleep-deprived, these are settings that make people very malleable. And you can see this in many of the brainwashing events in the 20th century.
This is Dr. Joel Dimmesdale, a professor emeritus of psychology at the University of California, San Diego, and the author of the book Dark Persuasion, A History of Brainwashing from Pavlov to Social Media. I tell Dr. Dimmesdale what you just heard about Aliyah's training regimen at the military academy. ...meant to do this and sort of getting the party line fed to her every waking moment.
Is that a form of what you're talking about?
So, when she has been isolated from her family and friends and only exposed to people who are constantly harking on this one view of what the world is like and what her task is, this begins to be a setup for coercive persuasion, even if it's against her best interest. Everything goes back to Pavlov.
Dr. Dimmesdale traces the modern history of brainwashing back to Russia. Specifically, the fact that the work of Dr. Ivan Pavlov was taking place at the same time as the Russian Revolution.
The odd thing in history is that, by virtue of his prominence, Lenin visited Pavlov and spent hours talking with Pavlov, asking him, could Pavlov help Lenin remake the people of the Soviet Union so that they would be better communists? So the Soviets were always interested in behavior change, in trying to be as scientific as possible about it, and Pavlov was a perfect vehicle for exploring that.
I asked Dr. Dimmesdale about the science of this behavioral change. What are the conditions that make this possible, not just for Aliyah, but for anyone who's being reprogrammed to lay down their lives and their ethics for their country?
If you had a checklist of how you persuade people so that you can guarantee behaviors that there would be resistance to. otherwise, that checklist would include, number one, isolate them away from contrary influences. Number two, put them under a lot of stress. Number three, deprive them of sleep, so they're not thinking clearly. Number four, involve them in a group that hammers home certain messages repeatedly.
We now know the steps that lead to brainwashing, or coercive persuasion, as Dr. Dimmesdale prefers to put it. But brainwashing for what? Let's move forward to Russia in the 21st century.
War was central to the Putin regime.
This is Ian Garner, a Russian historian and author of the book Z Generation, into the heart of Russia's fascist youth.
Right, we see that from the very first actions that Putin takes when he's in power. And where we start to see a real change is in what children taught in school. Children learn war poems. Children start to dress up in military uniforms. They start to be taught that war is a good thing.
War is something we need to grow our society and become better people. Joining the army, becoming a part of this military machine in Russia, is just a hugely respectable part.
The propaganda that helps make this possible, Garner says, is history lessons, revised history lessons, just like the ones Aliyah received during her training.
This is not going to be lessons about real history. This is going to be the Russian version of history, in which Russia is surrounded by enemies who are looking to destroy it, and Russia has saved the world, and you're going to be a hero if you sacrifice yourself, just like those folks at Stalingrad 80 years ago.
Stalingrad, as you may recall, is the deadly World War II battle that Aliyah's grandfather served in, and the monument there with his name on it is practically a shrine for Aliyah's family.
There is this phrase by Semyon Zopanedov in Russian, thank you, granddad, for bringing us victory. And what they're talking about is World War II, and all of this comes down to the myth of the Second World War as the moment when a generation of grandfathers sacrificed themselves to save the world and to save Russia, to save humanity from the Nazi threat. Thus, we respect them. It's a kind of ancestor worship. The sacrifice is coded that the sacrifice, the death, has to happen.
It's a bit like the Christian myth, right? It's Jesus. Jesus has to die to save humanity. Russian soldiers have to die. The country has to suffer so that it can be birthed anew.
Russia's President, Vladimir Putin, is in Volgograd, formerly known as Stalingrad, to commemorate the 80th anniversary of the Soviet victory over German forces at the Battle of Stalingrad. He later spoke at an event where he criticized Germany for helping to arm Ukraine. He said Russia is once again threatened by Germany. This is his latest attempt to compare Russia's war against Ukraine to the Soviet victory over Nazi Germany in World War II.
Russian news, Russian education, and especially Russian social media, Gardner explains, have turned into an actual indoctrination program, teaching not just a warlike way of thinking, but actual military skills to the youth.
Because they're so desperately rushed to get them to the front, it is giving that training to children today, and they will be ready tomorrow to fight.
At what age does that training start?
Six years old.
Wow. It's interesting, again, because her training started from her dad at age six, I think age six or seven.
Her experience then was exceptional and unusual, but now that experience is being not just institutionalized and formalized by the state, it's also being held up as the ideal of what a young child can be.
Hi, it's Andrea Gunning, host of Betrayal. I'm excited to announce that the Betrayal podcast is expanding. We are going to be releasing episodes weekly, every Thursday. Each week you'll hear brand new stories, firsthand, accounts of shocking deception, broken trust, and the trail of destruction left behind. Stories about regaining a sense of safety, a handle on reality after your entire world is flipped upside down.
From unbelievable romantic betrayals.
The love that was so real for me was always just a game for him.
To betrayals in your own family. When I think about my dad, oh, well, he is a sociopath. Financial betrayal.
This is not even the part where he steals millions of dollars.
And life or death deceptions.
She's practicing how she's going to cry when the police calls her after they kill me.
Listen to Betrayal Weekly on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.
I'm John Walczak, host of the new podcast, Missing in Arizona.
And I'm, Robert Fisher, one of the most wanted men in the world.
We cloned his voice using AI.
In 2001, police say I killed my family.
First mom, then the kids.
And rigged my house to explode. In a quiet suburb.
This is the Beverly Hills of the valley. Before escaping into the wilderness.
There was sleet and hail and snow coming down.
They found my wife's SUV. Right on the reservation boundary. And my dog flew.
All I could think of is him going to sniper me out of some tree.
But not me.
Police believe he is alive and hiding somewhere.
For two years.
They won't tell you anything.
I've traveled the nation. I'm going down in the cave. Tracking down clues.
They were thinking that I picked him up and took him somewhere.
If you keep asking me this, I'm going to call the police and have you removed.
Searching for Robert Fisher.
One of the most dangerous fugitives in the world.
Do you recognize my voice?
Join an exploding house.
The hunt.
Family annihilation.
Today. And a disappearing act. Listen to Missing in Arizona every Wednesday on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your favorite shows.
We return now to Aaliyah's first day at the military academy. Selected out of the lineup along with four other women, she was told she'd been chosen to participate in a special, top-secret program to serve her country. A few hours later, the top commander of the academy, the colonel who'd chosen her from the lineup, called her into his office.
After a few hours, I was called to my teacher's office.
So I came there, and he closed the door. And I did respect him a lot, because he was much older than me. That time he was 48, and I was 18.. And I was very innocent. As I said, like I never kissed any man.
As Aaliyah tells the story, you may hear some laughter here and there. But note that there's nothing funny about this. There are topics that bring up so much trauma, and are so uncomfortable to discuss, that sometimes we laugh in order to avoid the deep pain that these events bring up. In an often-cited research paper, If I Didn't Laugh, I'd Cry, Dr. Kathleen Monaghan further explains that laughter creates a sense of relief, usually from stress, both mentally and physically, thus giving way to a sense of hope.
Listener, discretion is advised.
And I looked at him, and I asked him, like, hello, like, you know, like, yes, sir. You were calling for me, so I'm here.
And he was wearing his uniform with medals and everything, looking so sophisticated and so powerful. Like, my dad, when he was wearing uniform, I always respected that.
He asked me, you know, like, what do you really expect from this education? And I said, well, you know my story, you know whose daughter am I, and I am here to follow my dad's path, and I'm ready to study and learn anything. And he asked me, are you ready to do everything for your country? I said, yes, sir. Are you a real patriot?
And I said, yes, sir, I was raised by my dad to protect my country, my people, and I'm ready to give, like, to do everything for my country. And he asked me, like, are you ready to do everything, are you ready to give your life for your country? And I said, yes, sir, certainly. Of course, I was trained by my dad, and I love my country, and I love my people. And then he came closer to me, and he said, then suck my cock.
I was like, sorry, what? I just couldn't even understand. what did he ask me, and I was sitting at the chair, and he came closer to me, and I was, my hat was right in front of his,
his, that part, so I was, I didn't know what to do. And he came so close that I couldn't really just stand up and leave.
I just had, like, one thing in my head that, wait a minute, he knows that, who is my dad, and yet he just asked me to suck his cock. Like, how is that possible? I thought that the name of my dad will protect me from this kind of stuff.
And he, kind of like, he, almost like he, read my mind, and he said, yes, I know who is your father, and you know that I have much higher rank than your dad. So, everything depends from my word. And if you want to study here,
and graduate with no problem, and have a good job, then you have to do what I say. And if you want, I'll make sure your life will become hell here, and you cannot just drop off because of your dad, and I'll make sure you will have a lot of demerits, with a lot of duty and hard work, outside, cleaning toilets, and cleaning garden, and just be a bully here. What do you prefer?
And he opened his zip,
and he took his penis off, just in front of my mouth.
And he said like, suck it, what are you waiting for? At the moment? I was thinking, alright, so I cannot do anything bad to him right now, I cannot bite it, right, even though I'm angry inside, from this man for doing this to me right now. To disrespect my father, who disrespect my principles, my beliefs, in my country, in my people, who came here to basically sacrifice my life, not for sucking his cock, but for protecting people, and doing really good for this country.
But I told myself, you know what, I'll make sure that one day he will pay for it.
And when he did come, I had that, I made this decision, I stand up from the chair,
and he asked me, I want you to swallow it.
And I pretended that I did, he's like, go, to your lesson.
So I took my bag and I left. But then, when I left, I went to the toilet, and I washed my mouth, and I looked at the mirror and I started to cry, because it was just so, I was disgusted, but I was,
you know, like that feeling when, you know, you're like, your dreams, and everything is just like, everything's just gone in one second. And then I said to myself, okay, so, so now what? I obviously couldn't tell anyone about this act, because, I mean, come on, who am I supposed to tell it to? To my dad? Oh, you know dad?
Like, I mean, I know my dad, he would go crazy, and then it would be all, I don't know, like, he might kill him and then go to jail, or like, it would be such a drama. So I know my dad, and I was like, no, this is definitely, I cannot tell him. So whom do I say? So this colonel teacher, he is the highest level, so whom do I go? There is no one to go to, there is no one to complain to, like, whom do I go to?
To police? I mean, he's like, this is the power, I mean, whom do I go, whom do I say? And it already was the second time when I was sexually abused, in the military, by the people who are supposed to be, like, you know, to stand for justice. How, I mean, like, all my romantic feelings, all my dreams, all my, you know, like, these words by my dad telling me from early age that I should be the one who protect people and love my country, love government, you know, love police, and love military. My dad, who was wearing this military uniform every single day, and I would look at him, and then exactly the same military person, just abused me.
How is that possible? I mean, how?
In the days that followed, Aliyah learned that her special training was about learning the art of sexpionage. She also learned that the exploitation of the academy would continue indefinitely, and that the male officers expected the female seduction students to have sex with them for what they claimed was training and desensitization purposes.
So, Aliyah thought, if these techniques work on enemies of the state, then perhaps they will also work on the state as well.
And that moment I created a plan. I thought, what if I will seduce this colonel? What if I will seduce him the way that he would fall in love, and then he can do what I want him to do, and he will protect me from things which I don't want to do, like, for example, sleeping with all of those teachers. And I understood that if I would manipulate him the way, he would feel that I'm his girl and nobody is allowed to touch me, then it will help me to go through that education. You know what I'm saying?
I thought, it's better I would have sex only with one teacher rather than with all of them. And he had the strongest position among all of them. So, for me, it was easier to become his lover rather than just being a whore for everyone.
And that's when, with nowhere else to turn, Aliyah took justice into her own hands.
And I'll be fucking so good. I'll learn so much. I'll make sure that I'll become the best. It's funny how these seduction techniques work, because eventually he told me that he wants to divorce his wife in order to marry me.
Check out our show notes.
Hi,
it's Andrea Gunning,
the host of Betrayal. I'm excited to announce that the Betrayal podcast is expanding. We are going to be releasing episodes weekly, every Thursday. Each week, you'll hear brand new stories, firsthand accounts of shocking deception, broken trust, and the trail of destruction left behind. Listen to Betrayal Weekly on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.
I'm John Walczak, host of the new podcast, Missing in Arizona. And I'm Robert Fisher,
one of the most wanted men in the world.
We cloned his voice using AI. In 2001,.
Police say I killed my family and rigged my house to explode.
Before escaping into the wilderness.
Police believe he is alive and hiding somewhere.
Join me. I'm going down in the cave. As I track down clues.
I'm going to call the police and have you removed.
Hunting.
One of the most dangerous fugitives in the world.
Robert Fisher.
Do you recognize my voice?
Listen to Missing in Arizona every Wednesday on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your favorite shows.
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